Do I need a new machine?

System

Hi all, wondering if you could all shed some light for me.. I am relatively new to espresso at home and need some advice.  

I have a Breville Cafe Roma espresso machine with which I can make what I consider a decent espresso, I was hoping you guys might be able to give me your opinions on this inexpensive machine and perhaps help me with the selection of a new machine..

Cheers,
Paul

Reschsmooth

Hi Paul I will be first to chime in here - we need to know what kind of budget you are working on, whether or not you have a suitable grinder. The grinder is generally considered to be more important than the machine (otherwise, it's like having a $20,000 home theatre system with $10 speakers). For a machine, I would start off here: http://www.keesvanderwesten.com/index2.html and then work backwards in terms of budget, etc  ;D P

Unknown

Thanks Reschs.. I'd be looking at spending about $600 - $800 dollars but if there was a machine out there that I would get more longevity from for $1000, I'd consider that too.  I'll check out that site and let you know how I go... Cheers, Paul

Unknown

Thanks Reschs.. I'd be looking at spending about $600 - $800 dollars but if there was a machine out there that I would get more longevity from for $1000, I'd consider that too.  I'll check out that site and let you know how I go... Cheers, Paul

Remus

for around the $1K mark i doubt you'd find a better package than the rancilio silvia and rocky grinder.

BeanCounter

Paulie, A few clarifying questions: Do you have a burr grinder? What sort? If not, does your budget include one? What sort & quantity of drinks will you be making regularly? Straight espresso shots, cappuccino and/or latte drinks, hot chocolate for children, etc? If you don't have a (decent) burr grinder, you'll need to buy one. Prices start at around $250 for grinders like the Lux and around $400 for the Rocky. If you plan on making primarily espresso drinks without steamed milk then that allows a broader range of machines. If you will only be making a couple of milk-based drinks at a time then the range narrows a little but you can get a good machine for your money; if you hope to make a few milk drinks regularly then your reasonable choices narrow further and your budget may be inadequate if it includes a grinder. To qualify the above, it is possible  to make multiple milk-based drinks on a small/cheaper machine but for ease and convenience, you tend to get what you pay for. A $1,000 budget will get you a good quality home kit for making espresso and a couple of milk drinks at a time. Regards, Gary

Unknown

Thanks for the info Gary.. you wouldn't believe it but along with my el-cheapo Breville Cafe-Roma, I have a $27 grinder from Woolies.. heheheehe... so yes the $1000 budget has to include a decent grinder.  Resches suggested the Rancilio combo but I can't seem to find that for less than about $1279 for the Silvia and a Rocky.   Most of the time, we make 2 milk based coffees, sometimes up to 6 with friends.. it's painful having to make 6 caps with a Cafe-Roma machine.. it takes a good 30 minutes.

Unknown

Thanks for the info Gary.. you wouldn't believe it but along with my el-cheapo Breville Cafe-Roma, I have a $27 grinder from Woolies.. heheheehe... so yes the $1000 budget has to include a decent grinder.  Resches suggested the Rancilio combo but I can't seem to find that for less than about $1279 for the Silvia and a Rocky.   Most of the time, we make 2 milk based coffees, sometimes up to 6 with friends.. it's painful having to make 6 caps with a Cafe-Roma machine.. it takes a good 30 minutes.

Lovey

G'day Paul, I would be looking to spend a decent amount of cash on a grinder before you think about upgrading your machine, especially if its only new.  If you buy a top quality grinder, it will last you for many years to come, and it will probably see you through a few coffee machines. Just my 5 cents worth (2 cents rounded up.) All the best, Steve.

BeanCounter

Thanks for the info Gary.. you wouldn't believe it but along with my el-cheapo Breville Cafe-Roma, I have a $27 grinder from Woolies.. heheheehe... so yes the $1000 budget has to include a decent grinder.  Resches suggested the Rancilio combo but I can't seem to find that for less than about $1279 for the Silvia and a Rocky.   Most of the time, we make 2 milk based coffees, sometimes up to 6 with friends.. it's painful having to make 6 caps with a Cafe-Roma machine.. it takes a good 30 minutes.

Paulie, For the money you won't be able to find a semi-automatic machine that will comfortably produce 6 cappas relatively painlessly. The ability to switch between brewing and steaming quickly is the domain of heat exchanger and double-boiler machines - many of which start at around $2,000, but one of which can be got for around $1,000. Given that, there are a number of machines and grinders that will produce good quality drinks (though probably limited to two at a time re: steaming capacity). The types of machines I'd suggest you look into are: Silvia - around $700+ Gaggia Baby/Classic - not sure of new prices - maybe $500+, but can be bought through online auctions cheaper. Imat/Nemox/Quaha - around $500-700. Some come with a built-in Lux/Imat grinder. On the grinder front there are such beasts as: Rocky $450 Lux $260 Cunill Tranquilo $400 Without trying to be facetious, I'd base any purchasing decision on how likely it is that you'd want to upgrade the machine within a year or two. Many people exixt happily with the above for years, others (like me) feel the call to upgrade after less than 12 months. If it were me (with the inherent dangers of that), I'd go for the Lux or something similar, and a Silvia. The Silvia is a great machine, rock solid, with heaps of support in the coffee geekdom world and a solid resale value in case you upgrade. I'd view the Lux as something more temporary, though it's a good solid grinder for the money. An alternative path is the Gaggia or Imat and a Rocky. The Gaggia has a small aluminium boiler with fast heatup time and quick recovery between brewing and steaming. I'd check out the consumer reviews at CoffeeGeek, and try to find a reseller who will let you play with the machines and answer your questions. Regards, Gary

nzroaster

I have the Rocky/Silvia combo for $1,150 if you are interested.

Unknown

I have the Rocky/Silvia combo for $1,150 if you are interested.

That kind of money is sounding a little better.. Thanks for the info Gary (BC).  I'm really only a beginner so I'd like to think that a setup like a Silvia & a Rocky would last me more than 12 months.  I consider the step up from the Breville and the cheap grinder quite large so the new quip should last.  8) I'll probably end up with a grinder now (Rocky) and a Silvia later just to break up the cost a little. Cheers, Paul

Johann

Hi Paulie, If you're currently happy with the Breville, what about keeping things nice and simple with a good old Saeco Via Venezia and a good grinder.  I've seen them on www.coffeemachine.com.au for $435.  This will give you a fair bit of change to put into a grinder. Also, Have you had a look at the current issue of Crema?  They've road tested manual and automatic machines that are under $1,000.  I'm not sure if you're after a fully auto machine, but the Saeco Incanto's came up equal 2nd in the Crema review.  They come with a conical burr grinder built in, and will make your dinner parties a breeze.  Again, when I bought my machine from coffeemachine.com.au I know there were a good price there, but I can't remember how much they were.  Could be worth investigating if you're considering going fully automatic. Something to think about, anyway.  Good luck! Johann

Reschsmooth

I basically had very good service from a Saeco Via Vanezia for almost 2 years (before upgrade fever and incessant nagging to the better half saw the upgrade...). The machine can be had for about $400+ and I would recommend you allocate a further $50 or more for the non-pressurised portafilter. Preparing 2 milk based drinks would take about 5 mins all up from the start of the extraction to cleaning the steam wand. The milk texture was pretty tight, the extractions (20-30 ml) in about 20 seconds. These machines, unlike others like the Silvia, don't have the 3 way soleniod or whatever, so you can't take the pf out straight away or you will get the 'portafilter sneeze' - not very nice and very messy. Otherwise, apparently La Marzocco are bringing out a single group home machine which will have a 3L steam boiler and a 2L brew boiler - I think it is going to sell in the States for a measly $4,500. Looks good though. Patrick

Unknown

Well, I've decided to stick with the Breville and the Woolies grinder while I learn about the process a little more.  Just by applying some of the techniques I've read about on the Crema forums.. particularly the info about the grind, extraction time (20-25 seconds) and correct milk temperature my coffee is becoming better and better!  ;D Thanks for all the help guys and gals!!

Unknown

Well, I have made some progress.. I pulled out this old Russell Hobbs machine that I had in the cupboard.. it's only a $99 dual unit (the one with drip filter on one side and "espresso" of the other).. it turns out that this little baby has a boiler.   I was getting frustrated with the time it was taking to texture milk on my Breville Cafe Roma (3-5 minutes) so I thought I'd test the steam production on the RH machine... I was very surprised to discover that this machine produces very dry steam compared to the Cafe Roma and I can texture whole milk to 65 degrees in about 45 seconds.. I AM VERY HAPPY.. I'm going to stick it out with my two beasts for the moment and I'll be pleasantly surprised with the performance of a decent setup like a Silvia or similar..  :o