Rio coffee stale

lars · March 2010

Hi guys - have been getting my coffee for several years now from Rio, as I thought being a local roaster, there was a better chance of getting if fresh than the out-of-state imports. However, I got some last week, and it was stale & oily within about 3-4 days, even though sealed in a Vacuvin and stored in a cool spot.
Am just wondering if anyone knows whether there have been any changes at Rio recently (eg change of roaster) that could explain this?

L

admin · March 2010

for those of you who're not aware, Rio is based in Adelaide; for some reason our Adelaide's best coffee thread [under Best cafes] has dropped off - will get this fixed and then Lars, will move this post there, as it's a more appropriate spot. A PS some of you might be aware that Forum member Ian Callaghan [Bar Nine] is also distributor for WA's Five Senses coffee, so might be worth trying to contact him!

Lovey · March 2010

However, I got some last week, and it was stale & oily within about 3-4 days, even though sealed in a Vacuvin and stored in a cool spot. L

The storage method you're using could be the problem. There's been a bit of discussion on another Aus coffee site about using vacuum storage containers, with quite a few people shying away from them. The theory being that a vacuum is created around the beans, which causes the beans to release their oils quicker than if they had been stored at normal air pressure. The best way I suppose would be to get a bag of beans and split them into different storage methods and see which one works best. All the best, Steve.

askthecoffeeguy · March 2010

I purchased some beans recently from a well established and 'reputable' Melbourne based coffee supplier - was even handed them over the counter from the ovener with a smile - only to get home and find that they were over six months old! lesson learned! never since have I bought beans locally for home use as I prefer to roast my own! even so I suggest that you take it up with the supplier as they'd be in the best position to know...

admin · May 2010

actually now that we've moved to SA, decided to try Rio for myself. Bought two 250g packs of their 'crema' blend [for obvious reasons] and asked if they had been recently roasted. Was assured that yes, they were extremely fresh. Got back and discovered the telltale oiliness and 'cigar' smell of beans at least 10 days to two weeks old. Resultant coffee was obviously not great, as well. Returned to Rio and they agreed to replace them, although grudgingly; am pretty sure that if i wasn't editor of a coffee magazine [& got a little grumpy about it as well] they wouldn't have. Not impressed. A

blanyon · May 2010

Are you suggesting that once coffee is 10 days to 2 weeks old it is stale and the coffee will be awful?

admin · May 2010

Hi Moto - definitions vary, but I certainly categorise any coffee over 2-week's old as stale, yes. I guess the main problem I had was that they when specifically asked, they implied that it had only just been roasted, which was clearly incorrect. A

askthecoffeeguy · May 2010

any decent coffee worth its salt should have it's 'roasted on' date clearly printed on the packaging (as opposed to the 'use by' date which in Australia at least is TWO YEARS after it was roasted at my work we aim for min ten to twelve days post roast to serve our coffee - as this is what works best with our roast profile conventional wisdom is that coffee is good for as long as it takes to degas which is traditionally up to four weeks post roast I would say that oily coffee smelling of cigars is probably much older than that and in roaster parlance at least an ashy aroma is usually associated with coffee which has been taken into rolling second crack which many would consider to be over-roasted ACg

admin · May 2010

Quick note: I think this is a 'front office' issue only; actually in reference to Lars' question at the top -to my knowledge, Tony is still their roaster, and he's a great guy [& roaster]! A

Dry_bean. · May 2010

I stopped buying beans from Rio quite some time ago because of freshness issues and the fact that the staff on the front counter are less than receptive to complaints. >:(

admin · May 2010

yes, a bit disappointing really; that surly customer service thing went out in the seventies for most companies! :-\ A

hazchem · July 2010

I also was very disappointed with the last bag of Rio I came across. Supply of 5 Senses via Bar Nine or perhaps Mark Barun's place The Coffee Barun in Sefton Park are where I usually haunt when in Adelaide. Ian at Bar Nine and Mark are both really nice people and any time spent with them is not wasted!

lars · July 2010

thanks Hazchem - appreciate the recommendation! L

psaigh · July 2010

Thanks mate, appreciate the mention. Also Espresso Royale on Magil rd have great customer service and fresh tasty beans =D

Cherry · October 2010

Hello coffee lovers, I've been going to Rio's roasting house and experiencing great coffee and service. The first time I had Rio roasted coffee was when Mecca espresso bar in sydney opened a few years back. First time heard of rio. Tony was roasting for Rio then, wasnt impressed. With all the hype Mecca was on about I thought they were average. After going to Rio roasting house in last month, was recieved beautifully by Rios new head roaster. Next time in Adelaide ask front office, not retail shop to go into roasting area and hang with new head roaster. I'm sure most coffee lovers will have a great coffee !

Dry_bean. · October 2010

on 1286710065:

Hello coffee lovers, I've been going to Rio's roasting house and experiencing great coffee and service. The first time I had Rio roasted coffee was when Mecca espresso bar in sydney opened a few years back. First time heard of rio. Tony was roasting for Rio then, wasnt impressed. With all the hype Mecca was on about I thought they were average. After going to Rio roasting house in last month, was recieved beautifully by Rios new head roaster. Next time in Adelaide ask front office, not retail shop to go into roasting area and hang with new head roaster. I'm sure most coffee lovers will have a great coffee !

Maybe its the cynic in me but I have a suspicion Cherry may well be linked to Rio Coffee in some way.

blanyon · October 2010

Reads a bit like it, and I am sure that they will let anyone off the street walk in and interrupt one of their most important employees for a bit of a chat. ;D

Cherry · October 2010

Hello dry bean and motto, Newbe looking through site and found I had a different experience than that was being shared on forum. When was the last time either of you were their? I guess some roasters are more welcoming than others. And dry bean, a way to overcome your cynicism would be to go and see for yourself.

Dry_bean. · October 2010

on 1286797569:

Hello dry bean and motto, Newbe looking through site and found I had a different experience than that was being shared on forum. When was the last time either of you were their? I guess some roasters are more welcoming than others. And dry bean, a way to overcome your cynicism would be to go and see for yourself.

Good morning Cherry, your assuming I have never paid them a visit, when in point of fact I first dealt with Rio in the early 1970's when they were still located on the Norwood parade, in those days the coffee was good but the service was still very ordinary. As for the present, was in there a couple of months ago, nothing much has changed, beans still stale and service is still non existent, once you gain a reputation its pretty hard to shake it. Now then, what exactly is your connection with Rio? Cheers, DB.

lars · October 2010

Hi Cherry - you wouldn't be Gavin Folden - Rio's new roaster, would you? L :o

blanyon · October 2010

Cherry welcome to the forum glad you have had good experience with Rio, me I am speaking from no experience with the company at all (good or bad) just making a comment. Looking forward to you sharing more of your experiences. Cheers Brett

askthecoffeeguy · October 2010

I had good rio coffee at midali espresso in carlisle st, east st kilda, some time ago - but I've heard that the rio brand has had some credibility damage recently - a new roaster would have to establish their credentials very quickly and get some runs on the board, in order to turn around the tide of negative publicity...

Dry_bean. · October 2010

on 1286919853:

I had good rio coffee at midali espresso in carlisle st, east st kilda, some time ago - but I've heard that the rio brand has had some credibility damage recently - a new roaster would have to establish their credentials very quickly and get some runs on the board, in order to turn around the tide of negative publicity...

Not just recently Acg, the problems been building for years, once you take a reputation hit its hard to recover lost ground. I know what I would do. >:(

askthecoffeeguy · October 2010

What would you do? The coffee I had at Midali was very good but then so were the staff andthe equipment they were using...

Dry_bean. · October 2010

on 1286927123:

What would you do? The coffee I had at Midali was very good but then so were the staff andthe equipment they were using...

I'd start with staff training and attitudes, those that failed to respond positively would be in for a short sharp shock

a couple of people unexpectedly walking out the door for the final time tends to be a real attention focuser, to pre-empt the question yes I have been an employer and had to resort to this tactic a couple of times, its certainly an attention getter.

askthecoffeeguy · October 2010

In a previous incarnation I was a trouble shooter for a hospitality group where I had to go into under performing venues and turn them around and usually it was the senior management who were the first to go as they were responsible for entrenched attitudes and condoned poor performance,and inefficient practices...

Dry_bean. · October 2010

on 1286936882:

In a previous incarnation I was a trouble shooter for a hospitality group where I had to go into under performing venues and turn them around and usually it was the senior management who were the first to go as they were responsible for entrenched attitudes and condoned poor performance,and inefficient practices...

I agree with what you say, though this is a little difficult in a family owned business. Rio are a relatively mature company on the Adelaide scene and most of their sales are wholesale roasted beans, perhaps with ever increasing competition they are trying to appeal to the retail consumer.

lars · October 2010

Thought I'd give Rio another try - just got back... same old unpleasant service; except for Costa Rican SO, everything on shelves was at least a week (or more) old. L

Dry_bean. · October 2010

on 1286944172:

Thought I'd give Rio another try - just got back... same old unpleasant service; except for Costa Rican SO, everything on shelves was at least a week (or more) old. L

Why am I not surprised, in an operation that employs a full time roaster it cant be that difficult to arrange stock rotation so that walk in customers are able to buy beans roasted no more than a couple of days prior.

Cherry · October 2010

hello Lars, db, acg, motto. Lars did you go and visit the roasting team and have a coffee with them? What day from the roast do you like to drink your coffee? Day from roast is big debate. Very personal choice.Some people don't like their coffee before 7 days is there a right or wrong?

lars · October 2010

I like to drink my espresso between 2 and 10 days after roasting, so if I get coffee that's already between a week and 10 days old, it's not much good to me. L :-\

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