Grind v Tamp v Cake - Relationship

FreshCoffee2

Ah yes and with regard to getting some (or a lot

Remus

I'll go for a slightly more coarse grind and heavier tamp.

imo that will work the best. just trial and error. if you see it pouring our really watery, you know you go up a notch. and so on and so on. to really give you a kicker, once you get it right, make sure your note down the coffee type somehwhere and hwat grind setting you have it on. if you buy different beans next go you may need a different grind setting and it can be very frustrating if you don;t record what you've done. my simple way to remember this stuff is i have a sticky label on the inside of the cuoboard door i store my coffee in and i've just put down coffee type and grinder setting on it to refresh my memory. maybe i get confused cos i have different grinder settings for the 2 diffferent machines i have at home...maybe i just have a pisspoor memory...i dunno. 😃 it may sound anally retentive but its the best way to guarantee that the coffee you are extracting is the best it can be. you have a good machine, a good grinder. my philosophy is get the absolute best out of it !

Honest_Gaza

Thanks guys. The one thing that I've probably been ignoring is the amount of grind I am using. I believe that I'm possibly underfilling....will experiment further. FC....it's too late about the obsession part....I think I'm goooonnnnnnnee.

Honest_Gaza

I mentioned earlier that my extraction time was significantly shorter than the target 20-25 secs. I made a cappa this afternoon and timed the extraction time.....7 secs (nearly freaked me out) :-X So as per previous suggestions, I changed the grind setting, payed more attention to the fill level and exerted a little more tamp pressure. The result.....23 sec extraction time and a pretty damn good puck at the end of it. The sad thing is that the drinking of the coffee has become of lesser importance 😃 I'm amazed how the slight change in variables can change the end product. Obviously, a person making upwards of 100 coffees a day will attain a level of consistency. Pretty hard for your average garden variety home coffee drinker to achieve this level of consistency.....but I'm sure as hell gunna try :🙂

nunu

Try to keep at least one variable constant, like the tamp. If you tamp consistently, I find adjusting the single variable often yields the better result. Otherwise you'll be fishing around for ages. 20-25 seconds is nice for 15-20mL. Try 30 seconds for 30mL. Even get a graded shot glass to see how the pour is going. If you can't see an imprint of the screw on the coffee, it's obviously underdosed. If you need an extension to your group handle to get the portafilter locked in place, you've obviously overdosed. We're talking about a few millimetres of coffee, maybe half a gram either way.

Reschsmooth

It is incredible how almost imperceptible changes to dosing can make a difference. A gram more and you can choke the machine, a gram less and you get a 5 second gusher. However the other problem for home baristas is that we don't have many kilos of coffee to play with over a short period of time. I may try to pull 5 shots or so to get grind settings right with a new blend. However, the next day, the beans are, well, a day older, and you may find the grind setting is no longer appropriate. But hey, we don't do it just to drink coffee do we? ;D P

[deleted]

Hey HG! I just remembered.. you should (if you haven't already) go out and buy yourself a decent tamper.. I started using my Silvia with the silly standard plastic one and always had trouble tamping consistently.. I went to Toby's estate and bought a 58mm tamper that fits the Silvia basket perfectly.. it made all the difference.. I can consistently pull 45 second shots (i like it slow)!! A decent stainless steel tamper will cost you between $25 on ebay and $65 for a Pullman.. Luck!

FreshCoffee2

Please be careful with evil-bay et al...there is very little visual difference between a tamper that fits snug, and one that is only 1 mm smaller in diameter... What I'm saying is, sometimes you get what you pay for, and very often, it's not what you though it was! So the good quality tamper ends up costing its own price, plus the 25 dollars (plus postage) wasted on the tamper that didnt fit! Regardz, FC.

nunu

Good advice on your 500th post FC. A lot of times we're looking for bargains, as we do. There's nothing wrong with looking for the best deal, but you really have to beware of people selling off items at a ridiculously low price. While a 1mm discrepency might not look like a whole lot, just think of around the edges of the portafilter. There's somewhere not being tamped enough. If you tamp to get the previously untamped edge down, you're overtamping the rest.

FreshCoffee2

Thanks for that Nunu, I hadnt noticed until you pointed it out it was my 500th post! The point is, if you spend money to buy a tamper that fits...then it should bloody well fit! 😉 A discrepency of even just a humble millimeter (in the case of say, picking up a cheap 57mm tamper as opposed to a more expensive 58mm jobbie for a regular commercial size filter), still amounts to the purchase of a tamper that doesnt fit...so why bother? Chiz, FC.

[deleted]

Well FC, lets leave that up to HG. For anyone on a budget, I believe that a tamper that is 1mm smaller than the inside diameter of the basket is not a problem. My ADVICE is genuine... the standard tamper is hopeless for novices like me to get an even tamp, primarily due to its diameter. If I measured the inside diameter of my basket and it was 58mm for example, and I ordered a 58mm tamper from "evil-bay" as you call it, I would expect one that fits quite closely. If I (or anyone else) ordered a "58mm tamper" and was delievered something different, that is something I would take up with the seller. 😡

FreshCoffee2

My post was not intended to offend, certainly not anyone on a budget, it was only just to make people aware...as in "buyer beware". Kind Regardz,

Honest_Gaza

Paulie, FC....the tamp that came with the Sunbeam EM6900 appears to me, to be a reasonably solid hunk of plastic with stainless steel base. Certainly a lot more useful than the plastic straw with disc that came with my previous Sunbeam machine. As such, I am assuming that it is performing it's function correctly. In a review of the machine that was on "coffeeco.com.au" the reviewer went into great detail on the mechanics of the machine, possible shortfalls in the PF and baskets....but didn't mention the Tamp as an issue. So I'm hoping that it can be considered as "within specs".

mattyj

HG, when I had a look at the 6900, the tamp was one thing that impressed me. It wasn't as heavy as I was expecting (and I probably commented on that as a negative), but from holding it, and checking it's fit with the basket, I was really impressed. I would also imagine that being a bit lighter, it would provide some really good 'feedback' as you tamp - you'd be able to 'feel' the coffee as it's compressing into the basket.

nzroaster

HG, somebody pointed out keeping your tamp consistant and changing other variables. This is the best way to do it because it is hard to measure your tamp everytime. Once you get it right though its all practice. In regards to the tamper diameter, the 1mm makes a huge difference as if your outside 1mm isnt tamped it causes channeling through the sides. Remember, water is very lazy and will travel the path of least ressistance. If there is 1mm around the outside of your puck that is tamped less than the rest, it is sure to create channeling. If you havent found out already, channeling is becoming a major focus for barista and home coffee fanatics alike. Have you tried www.coffeeparts.com.au ? They have decent (price and quality) tampers.

[deleted]

Anyway, I was just trying to be "honest" Gaza 🙂 The difference that my "near enough is good enough" tamper has made is great.. PS: I measured my Ranc baskets and the tamper that I bought with a micrometer before I bought it. I was just trying to suggest the different options. Enough on tamp, Gaza is happy with the Sunbeam one which sounds like it's a lot better than the standard Silvia tamper. Paulie

Honest_Gaza

As I've continued to fiddle for the last couple of days (using the advice you have all given), it appears my main problem has been the "fill" level. I've been underfilling and as someone (I think Remus & Paulie) suggested earlier, this results in a collection of water at the top of the basket which produces the lovely slush I was complaining about in the puck. While this is possibly an obvious requirement for the seasoned coffee baristas.....it's easily overlooked by us beginners. My wife....she just looks at me and shakes her head at my new obsession 😃

Remus

HG i have personally found that the slush at the top of the basket is more due to a grind that is a little too fine. so maybe check that aswell mate. simple physics, (believe me it must be simple if i suggest it 😛 ), that even if you underdose; if the grind is correct then the water is still passing thru the coffee, down the pf and into the cup. why would you get water at the top if you underdose ? this is actually a question more than anthing cos i double + dose everything so i truly don;t know. to me though, if water is at the top of the basket like sludge then something is preventing the water passing thru the coffee. that suggests that either the tamp is too hard or the grind is too fine. great to see you're enjoying the process though mate. like you mentioned b4, it's not just about the coffee anymore is it !! 😃

Remus

FC you've mentioned "evil bay" a few times b4. have you had a bad experience ? i've used ebay for years and rarely had a prob. even had my manual pavoni machine shipped out from europe with no dramas at all.

Honest_Gaza

[quote]HG i have personally found that the slush at the top of the basket is more due to a grind that is a little too fine. so maybe check that aswell mate. simple physics, (believe me it must be simple if i suggest it